Manila Angles 🔫
I love playing in Manila. The place, where I took a first shot at playing live poker (semi-) professionally, will always be in my heart.
Most of the regs here maintain a good spirit of the game, some are looking for every edge. They are on short terms with the dealer and the floor, which helps them get away with lots of things - while they make sure you get punished at every occasion. They might team up with each other, especially during the tournaments.
These are the guys who don’t even try to be discreet, while they are spinning around on their chair, fish-detecting.
If you qualify, it’s your table that they transfer themselves to, as they throw one chip in front of the open seat to book a spot and bring an arsenal of filthy tricks along.
I mostly refer to the local regs and they mainly try to take advantage of the Western players. You occasionally see a foreigner get a little cheeky - but mostly in a dumb and innocent way.
My statement has nothing to do with racism. There’s quite a logical explanation. Firstly, the locals know all the tricks of each other and won’t fall for them; these are people new to the Manila poker scene that become a target.
Secondly, as a foreigner with any piece of common sense at all, you don’t want to p erform a shitty angle in a place like Manila, especially on a local, who is likely to be buddies with both dealer and the floorman, especially in an underground poker room.
In Asia a guy next to you might with equal probability turn out to be a scientist, a bandit, a famous sportsman or a millionaire, you can hardly guess by the way they look or dress.
One thing to remember: if you are a white person, you are a target, so look carefully and analyze everything. Believe nothing that you hear and only half of what you see.
What is an angle-shot? In my own words, an action that is techincally not breaking the rules and therefore can’t be penalized, often looks like it may or may not be conscious or intentional, but in the case it is, will be regarded as unethical because its aims to deceive an opponent and gain advantage in an unsporty way.
Some of the things I describe below are pure bad angles, others - angle attempts that end up being live tells for those knowing to interpret them. If one person in the world runs into this post and saves/earns himself some chips later in life, I consider my mission accomplished.
Angle 1 : First and classic, Hiding Big Chips
How it looks:
The guy intentionally puts the chips with a larger nomination behind the pyramid of a smaller nomination chips to look short-stacked.
He’s hoping that somebody with a big stack and any piece of the flop just says “all in”, intending to put him all in for what they think is less than a pot-sized bet left behind, when he’s got the best hand and 100bb more.
This set up does not work every day, because the villain and the prey have to sit pretty much facing each other at the opposite ends of the table and play a heads-up pot, both with strong holdings.
Once upon a time a turn brought a straight (for me) and a flush (for the villain), I said all-in versus a presumedly short stack... received a call and some bad news. That was the first time I did not ask for a count, I swear.
How to avoid that:
Be always aware how much your opponents bought in with and how their stacks change in the course of hours. In other words, this angle is just another way of how you get punished for not paying enough attention at the table.
Always ask how much your opponent is playing before you contemplate a shove, no matter how obvious it seems. Don’t feel uncomfortable to do so, you have every right for this information, it’s a dealer’s job to make a count, so your opponent does not have to answer or even move. If he has a go at you, don’t pay attention, he’s wrong.
If you see the guy next to you intentionally or not hiding his big chips, call him out so the whole table hears you. There is probably a live one sitting across the table, whom the villain is hoping to get.
What to do when it happens:
Pretty much nothing you can do. After all, it’s your problem that you did not ask for a count.
The floor will rule that an all-in should stand, while the bastard keeps demoing his content smile. These guys won’t even deny it was a set-up. Leaving the table is a great idea because this shit is tilting. Don’t go after the villain, he will rack his chips and leave in five minutes anyway, like most of the angle-shooters do.
Example:
This hand, involving Alec Torelli made the headlines and is considered (was presented as) a classic example of the situation.
We are left to wonder, wether his putting his big chips behind the stack was or was not intentional (I hope it wasn’t because I love his content).
Sometimes even an experienced player forgets to stack his chips correctly and another experienced player forgets to ask for a count and gets in trouble. This is the hand between the pros who battle for thousands of dollars. You will hear another pro at the table say he made a similar error earlier. If such thing happened to them, don’t be hard on yourself if it happened to you too. After all, it is just one stack and it’s better to pay 200$ for this lesson now, than 20000$ later in your poker career.
Angle 2: Raising out of turn
How it looks:
It’s your turn to act but the guy behind makes an obvious (sometimes Hollywood or even Bollywood obvious) forward movement with his chips. You are looking at him and may or may not tell him the action is on you. In both cases, he stops before his chips cross the line and says “Oh, sorry”, leaving you to exercise your option.
This is an little angle and stone cold live tell at the same time: whoever tries to bet while the action is on his opponent, never has a strong had and wants to discourage them from betting.
People with the nuts tend to sit as still and disinterested as they can, observing the action with the periferic vision and praying someone bets.
What to do:
A villain either wants to check behind and see the next card for free, or he wants to bluff.
If you have a strong enough hand and think that he’s gonna bluff, look very scared and check to him. Make a Fishface to induce, in my case, a Blondface.
In fact, Angle 2: In a big hand post-flop, any vivid attempt to act out of turn by a player, whom you identified as experienced, is likely designed to trick you, even a fold or a check.
The lower stakes players have that tell of looking impatient to fold their hand preflop. In 99% of the cases it is genuine, but if they somehow seem to be already folding, so you open and they raise or even overcall, that does not look good for you at all.
Furthermore, if we are talking about a three-bet four-way pot with their money in it - such players are never being careless, they are trying to mindfuck you... by actually giving away a deadly live tell. Once you know their tricks, the fuckers become very easy to play against:
If they pretend to be about to bet out of turn (Oh, sorry, it’s your turn) - they are actually weak.
If they pretend to be checking or folding - they have a monster and are desperate for you to bet and for players behind to call.
Example:
An American guy Charlie, “Oh, I am such a pro, just waiting for a seat at the higher stakes here”, arrives at the table and brings a heavy flare of a Poker Superstar and headphones with him. The diva handles his chips with too much skill, makes evaluative duckfaces at every showdown. Did he really call with such a bad kicker?
This type tops my personal list of the most disgusting opponents.
Three-way 3-bet pot. Flop 8 10 3 rainbow, the rockstar is first to act, flop checked through, turn is another 3. Our boy Charlie keeps demonstratively looking away from the table and seems to have given up (Another live tell! Whoever does that in a big pot usually has the goods). He checks the turn, the girl behind him bets, Charlie looks disgusted and his hand is ready to muck the cards, but after the third player folds, he suddenly raises. The girl tank-jams, he snap-calls and slowrolls.
- Ugh, you have aces, right?- she asks, tabling QQ.
- No, I have a full house, - he says proudly and flips pocket eights. - You have outs, - he adds in a patronizing voice. What a prick.
Charlie wanted to see not just a bet, but a call behind, that is why he was desperate to convince his both opponents, that he is not a threat.
Note: the girl was not me.
Angle 3: Accidentally betting too much
How it looks:
This is a vivid example, involving by Daniel Negreanu (which may or may not have been intentional).
The guy is opening and he puts a big nomination chip without saying a word. The dealer announces: “Raise, one thousand, or whatever”. The guy goes all sorts of oh my God, I didn’t mean to, I just wanted to limp and confused the chips. He is Bollywooding loud enough to draw everyone’s attention to his mistake. The guy actually has aces or kings and is hoping that some of the loose-aggressive/clueless amateur players decide to take advantage and put on a big raise. You’ll see none of the regs taking a stab, because they know.
What to do:
Fold unless you have a monster. If you deep enough and are feeling lucky, call with ace-crackers.
Angle 4: Accidentally Betting
How it looks:
The villain will pretend to have dropped his chips beyond the line at the right moment, so the dealer will rule that it is a bet. The villain will Bollywood long and loud enough that everybody notices he made a “mistake”. Again, strangely none of the regs will try to punish him.
What to do:
Don’t buy it. This guy has a big hand.
Angle 5: Accidentally Raising
How it looks:
“I raise... I meant I call” - they guy who says it has the nuts.
The dealer will force him to minraise. And you will be getting a good price on a losing call.
Here is a notorious example.
OR:
“I raise! Oh... I didn’t see there was already a raise in front of me”
The dealer will force him to minraise.
What to do:
Fold.
Angle 6: “He checked!”
This is an ugly one, because there is nothing you can do. At least, in Manila.
How it looks:
It’s your turn. You are looking down at your chips, thinking, Hollywooding, maybe even already making a forward move, while the person behind you does whatever is best for him, then claims you said check or tapped. His friends at the table confirm the story. Dealer was not paying attention so believes you checked.
Example: Pokerstars Live, Okada
A big hand in a tournament, heads-up on the river, villain has trips with a bad kicker and wants a free showdown as there is a straight and a flush possible. He checks to my mate Willy, who decides to bluff all-in and silently moves his whole stack across the line.
Willy raises his head and sees the villain flip his cards over.
- Was that a call?
- No, you said you checked.
- I didn’t. How was I checking if I pushed my whole stack in the middle?
The dealer was not watching Willy, and the villain’s friends, who happened to be playing at the table, confirmed, that Willy said “check”.
This hand cost Willy most of his stack as he was forced to show down his bluff candidate.
Example 2
This is a suspicious situation, that may or may not have been an angle.
I open UTG, flop the nut straight with a flush draw on board, bet 80% of the pot and get two callers. Turn is a blank. I look down at my chips, Hollywood tanking. I am certainly betting again, and betting big. As I lift my head, I see the second oppponent very quickly checking behind me and the dealer opening the river.
- Wait, what? The action is on me, I did not do anything yet.
- You checked, - said my opponents, both locals.
- I said nothing.
- But you tapped.
- I did not.
I look a the dealer, who somehow confidently confirms that I did a “probably accidental movement with my hand that looked like tapping”.
The river is already open, it’s another brick, I bet, my opponents insta fold.
I am positive I didn’t not do any check-like motions and think it might have been an angle because that was clearly a situation where both of my opponents wanted a free river with their draws.
I am not sure if I should have argued and called the floor. The fact that the river was already open made things complicated.
What to do:
I am starting to believe it might be a good idea to verbalize all your actions versus local regs and be very careful with your hand movements so nothing can be interpreted as a check.
Angle 7: Uncomplete Forward Motion
How it looks: here is the video.
It’s villain’s turn. He moves his chips forward like he’s about to bet or call or raise, or moves his cards forward like he’s about to muck, but does not cross the line.
In some places a forward motion will be considered a call or a string bet, in Manila it’s good if the dealer is paying attention to the villain at all.
What to do:
Do not react whatsoever, because the villain is trying to get information. You can’t get him punished for this. Make sure that the dealer clarifies the villain’s action before you showdown.
Angle 8: Crazy/Drunk Guy
This is the most creative and crazy angle I witnessed. It would have been also funny, if I hadn’t lost a big pot to the guy.
How it looks:
A reg is pretending to be drunken nutter to get paid.
He is loud and agressive, has a bottle of beer he is demonstratively drinking in a most disgusting fashion, burping out loud, dropping things on the floor.
He does all sorts of tilted stuff like “Change deck!”, throwing cards, blaming the dealer, 15x overbet shove “I am so sick of you betting, betting, betting!”.
There might be his friend at the table, playing a “random pacifying guy” role: “Oh, he’s just drunk, so sorry, don’t pay attention!”.
The goal is creating a table image that helps him to get called by a weaker hand when he has the nuts. Indeed, could you fold trips to such a guy? I couldn’t.
What to do:
If you happen to be in a big pot with such a guy, pause and reflect. Ignore his one-man show and analyze the line. Does it by any chance look super strong?
The Pissed Hollywood set aside, have a look at the way this guy handles his chips, remember the plays he have been making so far, his sizings, preflop hands selection... You might come to a conclusion that most of the things he’s done, apart from the drunken performance, scream “reg”. If so, you might want to give him credit.
Example:
Yes, right, I got fucked.
Masters Poker Club, Manila, NL200
I am running hot and almost doubled up my starting stack. An old Japanese (I think) man sits down with the same amount and starts acting hostile, whenever he is in the pot and somebody bets.
He defends his big blind against me and I c-bet a 9 2 2 board with a complete air. He insta jams for 80 big blinds more and I insta fold.
“So sick of it.. Soul read! You raise, raise, raise...”
He flashes one nine to show that he wasn’t moving in with too big of a hand. What if he had not one nine but two? We’ll never know.
The crazy man overbet jams a few more times but never gets a call. So he suddenly becomes a lot more agressive in his behavior, puts on a big show with a bottle of beer.
The guy next to me keeps telling me to not pay attention, “he is just drunk”. But if you think about it carefully, I am not looking bothered by the man’s behavior at all, number one. All we actually saw him drink was one small bottle of beer, two. He came to the table quiet and peaceful, three.
So where did he manage to get drunk and why is it so necessary no tell it to me, if I am sitting happy and smiling, waiting for a big hand to stack the nutter?
Let me tell you. The guy, I called him “Drunk Scotty Nguyen”, opens, gets two callers and I complete my blind with 7♥️4♥️. Loose, yes. I am running hot and looking to hit hard versus the man.
Flop comes 4♣️Q♣️4 ♠️ . Scotty checks, a fishy player, who has been doing lots of silly stabs, does his thing and I raise, make it about 12bb.
Scotty takes a loud and massive sip from his bottle, looks at his cards, asks:
“What? Raise? How much? Let’s see,” and calls. I am not worried at all because I have bought the “drunk Scotty Nguyen” story and think he could have anything.
Now, if you forget that he is “crazy”, what hands does he raise pre, checks the flop and then calls a raise with one more person behind? He would always C-bet a queen, aces, or kings, so it looks like a flush draw or a pocket pair lower than queens, which thinks I could be bluffing. He could have two queens as well. If he had A4 he would more likely limp preflop.
At that moment I am so happy about hitting my trips versus the drunk, that I don’t even think logically and put him on ace-queen. But this is never ace-queen, because he would c-bet it!
Turn is an offsuit 6, Scotty checks again and I bet 15 big blinds. All over sudden he minraises.
Check-minraise on the turn, coming from a reg (basically, from most other players too), is always, always bad for you. Against a classic nit that might be a fold on the turn with trips and bad kicker.
The river is an offsuit 2, Scotty leads into me and bets 50 big blinds. Because of my opponent’s image I don’t think too much, just shrug my shoulders, pay off the bet and flip over my trips, although he is supposed to show first. I mean, how many fours and boats does he have here, opening UTG?
He seems surprised to see that I have a four, and slowrolls me, looking at his cards, shaking his head. Then he says “Sorry, Madam” and turn over the pocket queens for an overfull. He quickly gets quiet, sobers up, racks his winnings and leaves, probably to get drunk for real.
CONCLUSIONS
Pay attention to everyone and everything, otherwise you will pay the price.
Always ask for a count.
Beware of any “accidental” bets, actions out of turn, unfinished attempts to act.
If you are 1% not sure, what your opponent did (he put a big chip and you don’t understand if it was a call or a raise) ask the dealer “What was the action?”
If you bet the river and your opponent flips his hand without saying a word, don’t show yours before the dealer makes it clear that he called and the chips are in the pot. Otherwise he might see that you got him and claim he folded face up.
Don’t show a bluff or make a sigh of relief until the opponent mucks his hand. Be careful, if someone just says “You’ve got it”, “Nice hand” etc but does not pronounce FOLD and does not muck yet!
If you decide to fold face up, loudly say FOLD before you show your hand. Verbalize your actions in crucial spots.
You are giving away nothing by uttering words (unless you sound like you are about to cry), because there aren’t many people capable of exploiting live tells or even thinking about them at the Manila NL200. I will tell you more, they are barely even paying attention.
FINAL NOTE
When my little cousin first came to Manila, he was playing at the same table with a guy from US, who was very well familiar with the field. This cool guy warned my cousin about all the possible shitty angles he might encounter. This guy from the US was cool. Be like him.
Worth watching: Daniel Negreanu’s video, where he gives example of some pure angles.